Gustafsson lost vs Silva: A Growing Pandemic

This has too stop. An increasingly used stand up strategy in the UFC is IMO... clearly against the Unified Rules Of MMA and in too many cases dictating the winners of too many matches.

To be clear, I quite like Alexander Gustafson. The guy is talented and has a lot of potential.

What I don't like is the stand up tactic that he used against Thiago Silva which left Thiago unable to engage him offensively and was the deciding factor in the fight IMO. Running form the opponent. Backwards, forwards, sideways... it shouldn't matter.

Gustafson did not use his reach advantage to keep Silva at bay. For the most part he used his feet and legs running backwards at hight speed away from his opponent while the opponent was attempting to fight and engage him. Many times he was running away backwards from Thiago, many times over long distances around large parts of the cage. Not just stepping back, not just backing off to duck a punch but running in reverse to avoid being struck. Thiago couldn't hit him due to the backward running from the fight 'not' because of any reach advantage.

This is becoming a pandemic in the UFC. Just like with Greg Jackson's infamous strategies, coaches are teaching this running away backwards strategy which is clearly against the rules. It's no different than strikes to the back of the head during finishing, it is clearly illegal yet the commission and the refereeing culture is not calling it by the letter of the rules.

This growing pandemic is determining the outcome of way to many fights.

Warning, point deductions... DQ. Simple as that!

Unified Rules Of Mixed Martial Arts - Fouls

23. Timidity (avoiding contact, or consistently dropping the mouthpiece, or faking an injury)

Timidity is defined as any fighter who...

a. Purposely avoids contact with his opponent

b. Runs away from the action of the fight

c. Falsely claiming a foul, injury, or purposely dropping or spitting out their mouthpiece or other action designed to stall the fight

http://www.abcboxing.com/unified_mma_rules.html - Foul #23

http://www.abcboxing.com/unified_mma_rules.html - Foul #23

Totally agree. LNP, running away, wall and stall, and all that BS is against the rules. Refs need to start enforcing this shit. Timidity is clearly against the rules. I agree w/ warning, 1-point deduction, second 1-point deduction, DQ. Simple as that.

we need to give this bitch style a name, how about we call it "bustin a tito"?

PRIDE NEVER DIE wrote:we need to give this bitch style a name, how about we call it "bustin a tito"?

Call it "ufceing"

Wolfman wrote:

PRIDE NEVER DIE wrote:we need to give this bitch style a name, how about we call it "bustin a tito"?

Call it "ufceing"

I like that how bout we call it jacksoning or zuffa jog or fag chop?

I can't believe that the swedish commentator called Gustafsson the white Ali....

I can't believe people are comparing jone jones to ali

um... No. Wrong.

Gustaffson wasn't running at all. He was hitting Thiago, and moving out of the way when he tried to hit him. There's a difference between 'timidity' and 'not throwing haymakers like a bum'

He wasn't running away from fighting and he wasn't avoiding action, he was moving, and landing all night, almost finishing him in the first round.

I would much rather see TECHNIQUE and SKILL over mindless brawling like you apparently want.

Misowaman wrote:um... No. Wrong.

Gustaffson wasn't running at all. He was hitting Thiago, and moving out of the way when he tried to hit him. There's a difference between 'timidity' and 'not throwing haymakers like a bum'

He wasn't running away from fighting and he wasn't avoiding action, he was moving, and landing all night, almost finishing him in the first round.

I would much rather see TECHNIQUE and SKILL over mindless brawling like you apparently want.

I totally agree that Gustafson showed great TECHNIQUE and SKILL...

TECHNIQUE and SKILL at retreating, withdrawing and running backward at high speed over large distances to the point where his opponent couldn't catch up with him to be and get close enough to hit him.

Gustafson rarely if at all threw any counter strikes. That is what great striking technique is. Gustafson didn't throw them because for 80%+ of the fight his body wasn't close enough to Silva to reach him with any counter strikes. Even though Silva was moving forward almost the whole fight and throwing punches. This is f...'n unbelievable already.

This NOT engaging a fighter and keeping them at distance through reach/jabs/kicks. Far from it. That is what Anderson Silva does. This was Houston Alexander meets Jon Jones doing the running man in his last few fights. Machida in his defense, endlessly throws some serious counter strikes when he is moving backward. He doesn't run half as far, or as fast, backward any more but Gustafson and Jone's are now exceeding that without the counter-striking.

The thing is, neither Gustafson or Jones is counter-striking, using head movement or merely stepping back out of the way of strikes when doing this. They are literally running away very fast in reverse from the fight. They do this for a lot/most of the fight over long distances in the cage. That should not be allowed by the referee as the rules do not allow it. Just like hitting to the back of the head... even in a finishing flurry. These things are illegal and are not being called.

Nice try anyway though.

Dagwood wrote:

Misowaman wrote:um... No. Wrong.

Gustaffson wasn't running at all. He was hitting Thiago, and moving out of the way when he tried to hit him. There's a difference between 'timidity' and 'not throwing haymakers like a bum'

He wasn't running away from fighting and he wasn't avoiding action, he was moving, and landing all night, almost finishing him in the first round.

I would much rather see TECHNIQUE and SKILL over mindless brawling like you apparently want.

I totally agree that Gustafson showed great TECHNIQUE and SKILL...

TECHNIQUE and SKILL at retreating, withdrawing and running backward at high speed over large distances to the point where his opponent couldn't catch up with him to be and get close enough to hit him.

Gustafson rarely if at all threw any counter strikes. That is what great striking technique is. Gustafson didn't throw them because for 80%+ of the fight his body wasn't close enough to Silva to reach him with any counter strikes. Even though Silva was moving forward almost the whole fight and throwing punches. This is f...'n unbelievable already.

This NOT engaging a fighter and keeping them at distance through reach/jabs/kicks. Far from it. That is what Anderson Silva does. This was Houston Alexander meets Jon Jones doing the running man in his last few fights. Machida in his defense, endlessly throws some serious counter strikes when he is moving backward. He doesn't run half as far, or as fast, backward any more but Gustafson and Jone's are now exceeding that without the counter-striking.

The thing is, neither Gustafson or Jones is counter-striking, using head movement or merely stepping back out of the way of strikes when doing this. They are literally running away very fast in reverse from the fight. They do this for a lot/most of the fight over long distances in the cage. That should not be allowed by the referee as the rules do not allow it. Just like hitting to the back of the head... even in a finishing flurry. These things are illegal and are not being called.

Nice try anyway though.

You are so self righteous, it's almost unbelievable

You have no idea, not a clue, what the difference is between not throwing haymakers like a bum and avoiding contact is, you make that painfully obvious by making this thread and continuing this point. Gustafsson wasn't running, he wasn't avoiding contact, if he was avoiding contact, he wouldn't have almost finished Silva in the first round. He wouldn't have consistently landed punches to the face if he was avoiding contact. why? Because that's not what avoiding contact is.

if Thiago Silva was coming forward, and Gustafsson continued to move backwards, not throwing a punch, clinching to avoid getting hit, and shoot takedowns that aren't meant to go anywhere, but just meant to stall the action, yes, that is avoiding action. But moving away from someone punching you, then punching them? That's not avoiding contact, you conceited dork.

Maybe you should stick to what you do best; feed off the attention of other conceited dorks, make long and unreadable posts about how Zuffa is the devil, and write up MMA suicide notes on Team Takeover, only to come back a week later and make more long and unreadable posts about your opinion, present them as facts, and have the internet collectively laugh at how much of an ignorant asshole you portray yourself as willingly.

to the admins of this collective circle jerk and conspiracy theories you call a forum (By the way, it's not a forum if everyone just agrees and blows each other on how great their 'opinions' are, forums are about discussion); Please, feel free to ban me for telling Dagwood he's a self indulged prick with nothing going for him except the ability to post nonsense. Monaro and PRIDE never die (cool name by the way, original, preach about how corrupt zuffa is but suck the dick of PRIDE until it falls off), feel free to call me a 'zombie', as if an outdated Bloodstain Lane term makes you any better than the people that you refer to as 'zombies'.

Misowaman wrote:

Dagwood wrote:

Misowaman wrote:um... No. Wrong.

Gustaffson wasn't running at all. He was hitting Thiago, and moving out of the way when he tried to hit him. There's a difference between 'timidity' and 'not throwing haymakers like a bum'

He wasn't running away from fighting and he wasn't avoiding action, he was moving, and landing all night, almost finishing him in the first round.

I would much rather see TECHNIQUE and SKILL over mindless brawling like you apparently want.

I totally agree that Gustafson showed great TECHNIQUE and SKILL...

TECHNIQUE and SKILL at retreating, withdrawing and running backward at high speed over large distances to the point where his opponent couldn't catch up with him to be and get close enough to hit him.

Gustafson rarely if at all threw any counter strikes. That is what great striking technique is. Gustafson didn't throw them because for 80%+ of the fight his body wasn't close enough to Silva to reach him with any counter strikes. Even though Silva was moving forward almost the whole fight and throwing punches. This is f...'n unbelievable already.

This NOT engaging a fighter and keeping them at distance through reach/jabs/kicks. Far from it. That is what Anderson Silva does. This was Houston Alexander meets Jon Jones doing the running man in his last few fights. Machida in his defense, endlessly throws some serious counter strikes when he is moving backward. He doesn't run half as far, or as fast, backward any more but Gustafson and Jone's are now exceeding that without the counter-striking.

The thing is, neither Gustafson or Jones is counter-striking, using head movement or merely stepping back out of the way of strikes when doing this. They are literally running away very fast in reverse from the fight. They do this for a lot/most of the fight over long distances in the cage. That should not be allowed by the referee as the rules do not allow it. Just like hitting to the back of the head... even in a finishing flurry. These things are illegal and are not being called.

Nice try anyway though.

You are so self righteous, it's almost unbelievable

You have no idea, not a clue, what the difference is between not throwing haymakers like a bum and avoiding contact is, you make that painfully obvious by making this thread and continuing this point. Gustafsson wasn't running, he wasn't avoiding contact, if he was avoiding contact, he wouldn't have almost finished Silva in the first round. He wouldn't have consistently landed punches to the face if he was avoiding contact. why? Because that's not what avoiding contact is.

if Thiago Silva was coming forward, and Gustafsson continued to move backwards, not throwing a punch, clinching to avoid getting hit, and shoot takedowns that aren't meant to go anywhere, but just meant to stall the action, yes, that is avoiding action. But moving away from someone punching you, then punching them? That's not avoiding contact, you conceited dork.

Maybe you should stick to what you do best; feed off the attention of other conceited dorks, make long and unreadable posts about how Zuffa is the devil, and write up MMA suicide notes on Team Takeover, only to come back a week later and make more long and unreadable posts about your opinion, present them as facts, and have the internet collectively laugh at how much of an ignorant asshole you portray yourself as willingly.

to the admins of this collective circle jerk and conspiracy theories you call a forum (By the way, it's not a forum if everyone just agrees and blows each other on how great their 'opinions' are, forums are about discussion); Please, feel free to ban me for telling Dagwood he's a self indulged prick with nothing going for him except the ability to post nonsense. Monaro and PRIDE never die (cool name by the way, original, preach about how corrupt zuffa is but suck the dick of PRIDE until it falls off), feel free to call me a 'zombie', as if an outdated Bloodstain Lane term makes you any better than the people that you refer to as 'zombies'.

I respect your opinion even though I may not agree with it. But one question If you think are fourm is a circle jerk why do you stay? Just a question nothing more, but if you want I got a spot right next to me for the circle ......j/k. Anyway most of us here dont like BSL....

Misowaman wrote:

Dagwood wrote:

Misowaman wrote:um... No. Wrong.

Gustaffson wasn't running at all. He was hitting Thiago, and moving out of the way when he tried to hit him. There's a difference between 'timidity' and 'not throwing haymakers like a bum'

He wasn't running away from fighting and he wasn't avoiding action, he was moving, and landing all night, almost finishing him in the first round.

I would much rather see TECHNIQUE and SKILL over mindless brawling like you apparently want.

I totally agree that Gustafson showed great TECHNIQUE and SKILL...

TECHNIQUE and SKILL at retreating, withdrawing and running backward at high speed over large distances to the point where his opponent couldn't catch up with him to be and get close enough to hit him.

Gustafson rarely if at all threw any counter strikes. That is what great striking technique is. Gustafson didn't throw them because for 80%+ of the fight his body wasn't close enough to Silva to reach him with any counter strikes. Even though Silva was moving forward almost the whole fight and throwing punches. This is f...'n unbelievable already.

This NOT engaging a fighter and keeping them at distance through reach/jabs/kicks. Far from it. That is what Anderson Silva does. This was Houston Alexander meets Jon Jones doing the running man in his last few fights. Machida in his defense, endlessly throws some serious counter strikes when he is moving backward. He doesn't run half as far, or as fast, backward any more but Gustafson and Jone's are now exceeding that without the counter-striking.

The thing is, neither Gustafson or Jones is counter-striking, using head movement or merely stepping back out of the way of strikes when doing this. They are literally running away very fast in reverse from the fight. They do this for a lot/most of the fight over long distances in the cage. That should not be allowed by the referee as the rules do not allow it. Just like hitting to the back of the head... even in a finishing flurry. These things are illegal and are not being called.

Nice try anyway though.

You are so self righteous, it's almost unbelievable

You have no idea, not a clue, what the difference is between not throwing haymakers like a bum and avoiding contact is, you make that painfully obvious by making this thread and continuing this point. Gustafsson wasn't running, he wasn't avoiding contact, if he was avoiding contact, he wouldn't have almost finished Silva in the first round. He wouldn't have consistently landed punches to the face if he was avoiding contact. why? Because that's not what avoiding contact is.

if Thiago Silva was coming forward, and Gustafsson continued to move backwards, not throwing a punch, clinching to avoid getting hit, and shoot takedowns that aren't meant to go anywhere, but just meant to stall the action, yes, that is avoiding action. But moving away from someone punching you, then punching them? That's not avoiding contact, you conceited dork.

Maybe you should stick to what you do best; feed off the attention of other conceited dorks, make long and unreadable posts about how Zuffa is the devil, and write up MMA suicide notes on Team Takeover, only to come back a week later and make more long and unreadable posts about your opinion, present them as facts, and have the internet collectively laugh at how much of an ignorant asshole you portray yourself as willingly.

to the admins of this collective circle jerk and conspiracy theories you call a forum (By the way, it's not a forum if everyone just agrees and blows each other on how great their 'opinions' are, forums are about discussion); Please, feel free to ban me for telling Dagwood he's a self indulged prick with nothing going for him except the ability to post nonsense. Monaro and PRIDE never die (cool name by the way, original, preach about how corrupt zuffa is but suck the dick of PRIDE until it falls off), feel free to call me a 'zombie', as if an outdated Bloodstain Lane term makes you any better than the people that you refer to as 'zombies'.

This is ridiculous. Gustaffason dictated the range & pace of the entire fight and did whatever he wanted to while Silva did nothing.

Not to mention he dropped Silva 2x which on my scorecard gives him two 10-8 rounds. (HOW REAL COMBAT SPORTS ARE SCORED)

Easy win for Gustaffason. War Sweden.

I disagree with the way it was said too. He did what he had to do. A little boring and all but it wasn't that bad. The swede won.

Some unnecessary drama here too.

I agree with OP. Gastaaffsson was RUNNING the entire time even though he was smashing Thiago's face. Silva was more hungry making him the winner

What do you know about striking Stillwill?

I agree that Gustaffason should have engaged more. If he had sat down on his punches he would have had his man out of there by the second. Still in no way did he lose, he coasted to an easy decision.

They really should deduct points from fighters avoiding combat, maybe he deserved it, but still he won.

This kind of thing is happening very often, which only make things very boring. Gustafsson could have done better IMO. I like the guy and i was expecting more.

StillWill wrote:This is ridiculous. Gustaffason dictated the range & pace of the entire fight and did whatever he wanted to while Silva did nothing.

Not to mention he dropped Silva 2x which on my scorecard gives him two 10-8 rounds. (HOW REAL COMBAT SPORTS ARE SCORED)

Easy win for Gustaffason. War Sweden.

welcome StillWill!!!

LET'S GET THIS MAN A THREAD GOING FOR HIS SPECTACULAR HLs ASAP DAMNIT

StillWill wrote:This is ridiculous. Gustaffason dictated the range & pace of the entire fight and did whatever he wanted to while Silva did nothing.

Not to mention he dropped Silva 2x which on my scorecard gives him two 10-8 rounds. (HOW REAL COMBAT SPORTS ARE SCORED)

Easy win for Gustaffason. War Sweden.

Nice to have another swede here

i have no clue what happened on this card

UFC on Fuel 2 Sees Slip Dip in TV Ratings

Saturday’s UFC on Fuel TV 2: Gustafsson vs. Silva marked the UFC’s second live event on Fuel TV, drawing an average audience of 197,000 viewers.

That’s down slightly from the promotion’s premier live event on the network, UFC on Fuel TV 1: Sanchez vs. Ellenberger. UFC on Fuel TV 1 drew an average audience of 217,000 viewers.

While these numbers are modest compared to many networks, Fuel TV executives have been ecstatic with the TV ratings that these shows and other UFC programming has drawn on the network. For Fuel TV, these numbers represent a solid increase over past programming, prior to the UFC.

UFC on Fuel TV 2 featured the further ascension of Alexander Gustafsson up the light heavyweight ranks. He had to go to a decision for the first time in his career, but did enough to win a unanimous decision over one his toughest opponents in Thiago Silva.

http://www.mmaweekly.com/ufc-on-fuel-2-sees-slip-dip-in-tv-ratings-from-ufc-on-fuel-1

StillWill wrote:I agree that Gustaffason should have engaged more. If he had sat down on his punches he would have had his man out of there by the second. Still in no way did he lose, he coasted to an easy decision.

My point was meant to be that.... IMO way too many times in the fight, Gustafson was running at full speed backwards away from Silva for long distances around the cage. He was continually disengaging from the fight in this manner not simply stepping away to avoid an attack. In fact, he was running so fast backward that Silva couldn't get into engagement-range coming forward running at high speed himself.

I'm not saying the Swede didn't out-score Silva. I am saying that 'if' the ref, or any ref, under the unified rules 'actually' begins to apply foul #23 as it is written then Gustafson would have been repeatedly warned, point-deducted and maybe even DQ'd. This stuff is not being called just like strikes to the back of the head during finishing. Whether it's the commissions not paying attention to it or whether it is a referee cultural thing, idk.

There is a huge difference between backing up to avoid a strike and continually running backward at high speed so that your opponent can't get close enough to hit you. Gustafson was doing this for most of the fight here. Jon Jones does this even more, even turning his back sometimes. It's a large part of their game plans. Shits gotta stop.

Dagwood wrote:Jon Jones does this even more, even turning his back sometimes. It's a large part of their game plans. Shits gotta stop.

i got so pissed off when he literally ran away from rampage's haymakers.

There's avoiding contact and then there's avoiding contact.

Some fights it's very easy to tell that a fighters game will be nothing more than staling, but there's
plenty of grey area where its hard to say if there's a clear violation and this fight was one of them.

A little hard to justify deducting points for avoiding contact and not engaging,
when the opponent's face is busted up.

The real problem is that these days victory at all costs is necessary to save your job as well
as your record, which has destroyed the spirit of one on one mixed rules hand to hand combat.